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Propane

Printed From: r-pod Nation
Category: Forest River r-pod
Forum Name: Maintenance Issues, Tips and Tricks
Forum Description: Have you ever wondered how something works? Found a good way to do something? Discovered the hard way what NOT to do? Share them here.
URL: http://www.rpodNation.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=2893
Printed Date: 19 Mar 2024 at 6:43am
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Topic: Propane
Posted By: Larry
Subject: Propane
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 4:18pm

So I just filled both of my propane tanks at the place where I store my R-Pod and I had and interesting discussion with the guy as he was filling my tanks;

 

1) He told me that propane tanks should not be filled up all the way, and even though I had 5-gallon tanks he only put 4.8 gallons in them. His logic was that you need to bleed propane tanks and leave some air in them. Never heard that before.

 

2) He also told me that gas stations usually charge for the full 5-gallons even though they, by law, only may put 4.8 or 4.6 gallons in your 5-gallion tank. Never knew that before either. BTW He only charged me for the 4.8 gallons.

 

3) He told me that propane tanks have and expiration date and showed me where it was located on the side of my tanks. Using the tanks beyond that period he said is unsafe. Another thing I did not know. The tank that came with my pod is good for 10-years and the second tank which I purchased is good for 12-years, but I don’t plan to have my r-pod that long.

 

4) How can you tell when your propane tanks need to be refilled; I mean do you have a meter or gauge on your tanks, do you lift them out of the cradle to see how light or heavy they are? What do you use, if anything, to determine when you need more propane?

 

There are two States in the U.S. where it is illegal to pump your own gas at a gas station; New Jersey and Oregon, but I do not know of anyplace in the U.S. where you can pump your own propane. I guess propane is probably more flammable or more dangerous than gasoline?

 




Replies:
Posted By: Ratdog
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 5:03pm
I don't know about other states but in FL propane dealers refuse to refill an expired tank. However, if your tank is in good condition you can get it recertified.
 
Also, never paint your propane tank a dark color. If you do, you will have trouble getting a dealer to refill it. I know . . . I've done it. Years ago I painted a tank black to match my BBQ grill and had to repaint it back to white before I could get it filled.
 
-- Steve


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Steve, Anne, and Paige the Rat Terrier
2013 Lexus RX 450h Hybrid AWD
2011 RP-177 (aka: The Circus Wagon)


Posted By: Skooterpod
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 5:08pm
Propane is one of the safest fuels there is.  At least, that's what I read somewhere.  MUCH safer than gasoline. 

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2011 RP-177
2010 Honda Ridgeline RTL


Posted By: pentachris
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 5:30pm
My understanding is contrary to the info you were told. As I understand it, tanks will hold the amount they are rated for with some headspace at the top of the tank. I've been to several places that don't fill the tank by weight; they fill it until propane is coming out of the overflow valve, leaving virtually no headspace. This is actually more than the tank is rated for, although they just charged me what the tank is supposed to hold. Not really dangerous for the tank - it has safety features to compensate. But, it is potentially harmful to the regulator you hook it up to because liquid propane, not gas, will be going to it. If you've ever seen a regulator ice over, it's probably because it was getting liquid propane. The regulator on my Weber Q is particularly sensitive, and I've had to replace it because of this. The info about filling capacity was given to me by the Weber rep I talked to.

As for knowing how much is in the tank, I pick it up and swirl it around. If it feels like it's getting low, I put it on the bathroom scale. There's a marking on the collar that says "TW: xx lb" that tells you the tare weight of the tank. From there, you can figure how much propane is in the tank. Some people use the hot water trick, and that's something I should try, but haven't yet. I'm sure someone else will be able to explain it; I'm not 100% sure, but I remember it sounding simple enough.

I think the danger with propane is the combination of flammability with high pressure.


Posted By: furpod
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 5:47pm
If you are running dual tanks, get an automatic switch over regulator/valve, when it switches over, remove the empty tank and go get it filled.The one we have actually has a little red pointer that points at the empty..


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Mark, Susie, Micah, and The Maggie.
'11 RP177(sold) '17 Lance 2295 http://www.rpodnation.com/some-of-our-mods-so-far-with-pics_topic2786.html" rel="nofollow - FurPodsMods
'17 Ford F250 CCSB


Posted By: furpod
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 5:53pm
Originally posted by pentachris pentachris wrote:

My understanding is contrary to the info you were told. As I understand it, tanks will hold the amount they are rated for with some headspace at the top of the tank. I've been to several places that don't fill the tank by weight; they fill it until propane is coming out of the overflow valve, leaving virtually no headspace. This is actually more than the tank is rated for, although they just charged me what the tank is supposed to hold. Not really dangerous for the tank - it has safety features to compensate. But, it is potentially harmful to the regulator you hook it up to because liquid propane, not gas, will be going to it. If you've ever seen a regulator ice over, it's probably because it was getting liquid propane. The regulator on my Weber Q is particularly sensitive, and I've had to replace it because of this. The info about filling capacity was given to me by the Weber rep I talked to.



You have not been able to "overfill" a propane tank for a decade. NO one will fill or exchange a tank with out a OPD valve. The only purpose of the OPD valve is to protect the head space in the tank.

Well and to confound every gas grill user in the country about 10 years ago. lol

Stolen from a website that knows..

"

An OPD Valve is easily identified by having a triangular knob with the words OPD marked on the valve itself. Overfill Prevention Device fitted valves are the result of extensive research into improving gas safety for you and your gas tanks. The new OPD valves prevent overfilling of gas cylinders, making filling and using gas cylinders safer than ever before. They are also compatible with your current gas appliances so it is easy to upgrade.

Older style valves were more susceptible to overfilling which leaves no room for the liquid propane to expand. As a result gas may escape, creating a potentially hazardous situation. OPD valves solve this problem by using a special float (shown right) which rises during refilling to block the filling process when the tank is 80% full.

The 1998 revision of the National Fire Protection Association's Pamphlet 58 requires that all cylinders, 4 lb. (1.8 kg) through 40 lb. (18 kg), fabricated after September 30, 1998 shall be equipped with an OPD valve. Further, any cylinders of these sizes that are re-qualified must be equipped with an OPD valve. If your cylinder is over 12 years old, it must be re-qualified before it can be refilled. It will be retrofitted with an OPD valve at the time of re-qualification. You can find the date of manufacture on the upper collar of your 20# cylinder. Effective April 1, 2002, no cylinder will be filled unless it is equipped with an OPD.



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Mark, Susie, Micah, and The Maggie.
'11 RP177(sold) '17 Lance 2295 http://www.rpodnation.com/some-of-our-mods-so-far-with-pics_topic2786.html" rel="nofollow - FurPodsMods
'17 Ford F250 CCSB


Posted By: Larry
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 7:29pm

Furpod, the guy who filled my tanks also told me about the OPD; it shuts down the flow of propane to the tank which is being filled and he told me that this often occurs prior to the tank being completely filled; leaving some space at the top; he also said that the person filling the tank should bleed the propane tank after it has been filled to allow for some space.

 

Thanks for mentioning the automatic switch over regulator I have to look into that!Thumbs Up

 

Skooterpod, I am not disputing what you have said, but if propane is safer than gasoline how come customers are not allowed to fill their own tank as they do when filling their car with gasoline?

 

 P.S. I was also told to never paint your propane tank any color other than white and that propane dealers will not fill tanks that are very old, have expired dates, or look like they have expired.



Posted By: pentachris
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 7:43pm
I obviously had some misunderstanding. I will say this, even though it's tangential to the topic: since I have stopped using tanks that are filled until the OPD operates and started using Blue Rhino "swap your tank" tanks which are filled by weight (to 15 instead of 20 lbs, by the way...), I have never had a problem with my BBQ grill's regulator.


Posted By: joe&carol
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 10:10pm
A couple things - - - - First, I've always understood that a tank only gets filled to something like 85% as a safety factor.  And it isn't just your little old 20# tanks that are subject to this, if you have a 250 gal or 500 gal tank it will be the same thing. 
 
The other thing has to do with checking the fill level. (This isn't original with me, it appeared on this site sometime back.) Just go to your kitchen sink and let the hot water run until you get a good head of hot water - - - draw yourself a pan worth or a pitcher full and go out to your tank.  Pour the hot water down the side of the propane tank and wait 10-15 seconds.  Then place your hand along the side of the propane tank where you poured the hot water.  The empty portion of the tank will feel warm; the full portion of the tank will feel cold.   Good luck and happy camping.  Joe


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Joe & Carol
r-pod 173


Posted By: pod people
Date Posted: 27 Sep 2011 at 10:43pm
I have used a propane tank level indicator that I got from Lowe's. It screws onto the tank  valve and the regulator hose screw into the indicator body.   It has a needle dial that goes into color ranges of green, yellow and red-not exact measurements, but a good indicator.  They cost about $12.  I've used them for years on my gas grill-they are effective, but not absolute.  Much better than guessing.

Vann Evans


Posted By: GaRedneck81
Date Posted: 28 Sep 2011 at 12:22pm
The reason not to fill the tank to the top is not for safety...it is to allow enough room for the liquid to boil off and turn to gas; so you can use it.

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GaRedneck81
U.S.Navy-Retired
Heavy Chevy 5.7 liter
RP-172
Kennesaw, Ga.


Posted By: tsunami
Date Posted: 28 Sep 2011 at 12:28pm
Federal Law mandates the use of OPD valves on all portable propane tanks!  Tanks that are installed as part of an RV chassis do not have to have OPD valves.  Propane dealers are NOT supposed to fill the older valved tanks. You can bring in an older tank and see if a local propane dealer would be willing to replace the older valve with the newer OPD.  However, as mentioned by another member, propane tanks have to be inspected every few years...you wouldn't want it to rupture because of corrosion or other damage.  The 85% fill level is built-in to allow expansion of the propane as it warms up in the tank.  You do not need to flare out any more of the gas to provide additional expansion.
Here in the Midwest, portable propane tanks are usually set on a weight scale as the tank is being filled.  So rather than gallonage, the fill is registered as 20 lbs, 30 lbs, etc. Most refill stations charge for a complete fill.  That is, if my 20 lb tank is half full, I still get charged for the '20 lb' fill...I guess this because the attendant still has to work with the tank, regardless how much propane is in the tank to begin with.
On my RV, which has a built-in propane tank...the fill station registers the gallonage of the fill.  So the cost is usually more accurate than when I fill a portable tank.  Because of this, I installed dual tanks on my Pod, with an automatic change-over valve.  I don't bring in the tank until it is completely empty.
The weight of the empty tank should be stamped on the tank.  You can set it on a bathroom scale to see how much propane remains in a partially filled tank.  Remember that a 'full' 20 lb tank should weigh only 17lbs more than the empty weight because of the 85% fill control.


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tsunami



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